Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

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Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Wed Mar 23, 2011 4:12 pm

Hi everybody!

I´m new at this site so what I´ll do first of all is to introduce myself. I´m Rodrigo C. Curiel from asturies and I simply love the sound of the bagpipes. It does not matter where I am I love that "war-of-hearts" bagpipe sound, don´t you understand?

The problem actually is that I´ve got no resources to buy one of those amazing instruments, and I´ve seen that arrownd the web there are many "how to" sites for bagpipe making. While I was traveling at the web I saw from another site the link of this page, so I entered and I get facinated.

Even when this site is great, I have not found yet what I´m looking for and that´s why I´m making this new topic. What I´m requesting for is for you to please give the measurements of one of this three kind of bagpipes: scottish, irish or spanish. You know... the drone (s), the chanter and the blowing stick (sorry I can´t remember it´s english name Smile) of even one of this kind of bagpipes, but if you could give me the 3 of them, you´ll help me a lot

Thank you everyone for your time and have a nice day! Very Happy

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:27 pm

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:41 pm

Hi seth!!

thank you for answering my topic the plans are simply amazing thank you soo much.

1 think i wanted to ask you is: in the plans down of E, D and C# (for example in the chanter plan) it says for E +/- 1/64", what does that means?

tank you again man you´re awesome

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:50 pm

cerecerorodrigo wrote:Hi seth!!

thank you for answering my topic the plans are simply amazing thank you soo much.

1 think i wanted to ask you is: in the plans down of E, D and C# (for example in the chanter plan) it says for E +/- 1/64", what does that means?

tank you again man you´re awesome

Its just variations in the measuring. If the not is flat move it up 1/64" and if its sharp, move it down 1/64". Use Gibson Bb Smallpipe reeds for the best results.

And upload a picture of yourself on the avatar so we can see you in all your glory.
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:57 pm

texasbagpiper wrote:

Its just variations in the measuring. If the not is flat move it up 1/64" and if its sharp, move it down 1/64". Use Gibson Bb Smallpipe reeds for the best results.

And upload a picture of yourself on the avatar so we can see you in all your glory.

god bless you thank you for all your help. Sorry for being a little bit "obssesed" whit this. The stoks of the dones can be made as I want? what I´m trying to say is: there´s no sound problem if I make as I want the parts where the drones are going to be "conected" whith the bag?

sorry for my "unknown" avatar, it´s because I´ve got no camera, but when the bagpipe is ready, I´ll send you (and to all the comunity too) a foto of myself playing it. I´ll try to buy one because this tech-world is just shounting me to buy it

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:11 pm

If you want to use Gibson reeds in the drones, then you will need to make the stocks at least 11/16", but I would go with 3/4" for the chanter stock and the blowpipe, and 9/16" for the drone stock if your unsure what reeds you will be using, practice chanter reeds, Fireside Reeds, or cane. Seth
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:18 pm

so both of them (chanter and drones) have to be made depending on what I´m going to use rigth? thak you so much seth. I´m living in asturies at infiesto in a quiet and alone place so I realy don´t know where to buy those gibson reed you are mentioning, so could you please tell me how to make them (I think cane or plastic ones are ok) or where to know how to make them? I now how to make the reed for the chanter, but the drone one are the problem.

rodrigo

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:22 pm

cerecerorodrigo wrote:so both of them (chanter and drones) have to be made depending on what I´m going to use rigth? thak you so much seth. I´m living in asturies at infiesto in a quiet and alone place so I realy don´t know where to buy those gibson reed you are mentioning, so could you please tell me how to make them (I think cane or plastic ones are ok) or where to know how to make them? I now how to make the reed for the chanter, but the drone one are the problem.

rodrigo

You can get the reeds at many bagpipe outlets in the U.S. online. You may have to do a lot of prototyping reeds if you plan to make your own. Good luck. This stuff takes practice so keep at it.
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:25 pm

tank you I so pleased for this man and you know it if you wanna come to spain just for relaxing like taking some vacations, count on me.

I´ll stay in touch man

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  Bob Salter on Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:25 pm

For uilleann drawings your first stop should be [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Just click on the images on the right to see the drawings. Im currently working on a chanter from one of these drawings.

Bob
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:56 pm

Bob Salter wrote:For uilleann drawings your first stop should be [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Just click on the images on the right to see the drawings. Im currently working on a chanter from one of these drawings.

Bob

Bob, are you working on a Kenna copy? Seth
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  Bob Salter on Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:02 pm

Yeah, Im doing the Timothy Kenna C chanter. These were the first 'proper' reamers I made. I made a prototype in oak[what I had to hand at the time, not ideal I know] and it seemed ok so Im now making it in ebony. I have heard great reports of this particular design so am looking forward to hearing it play.
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  texasbagpiper on Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:11 pm

Bob Salter wrote:Yeah, Im doing the Timothy Kenna C chanter. These were the first 'proper' reamers I made. I made a prototype in oak[what I had to hand at the time, not ideal I know] and it seemed ok so Im now making it in ebony. I have heard great reports of this particular design so am looking forward to hearing it play.

Making reamers is a bear, I hope it works out well for you. You should start selling chanters or sets if it comes out well. Seth
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:47 pm

Bob Salter wrote:For uilleann drawings your first stop should be [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Just click on the images on the right to see the drawings. Im currently working on a chanter from one of these drawings.

Bob

Thank you for replying too bob. I´m currently working on the small pipes plans that seth kindly has just given me and all is fine ´till now. I´m a little bit scared about the dimentions of the stoks and the reeds, but I´ll be on that as soon as I can finish the drones, the chanter and the blowpipe.

I think that making the uillean´ll be more dificult than the small pipes so first of the uillean I´ll be making a great highland pipes just to prove myself cause I´m just an old noob in this bussines.

thank you anyway for the information. If you or someone else have the plans for the GHB please I´d be so pleased if you could send them to my mail or even here at the forum. my mail's [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

good night, day or however it´s at your countries to everybody

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  MichaelLoos on Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:31 am

Hi Rodrigo,
you asked for three different instruments, and while there are some similarities between Asturian and Scottish bagpipes, the Irish uilleann pipes are totally different, altogether. The smallpipes Seth provided the plans for are different again, soundwise, but they would certainly the best project to start with, if you are new to instrument making in general and bagpipe making in particular. Also, they are fine for starting playing, as they don't need much air and much pressure, and are quiet. You didn't mention what type of music you intend to play, this determines largely what type of bagpipe is right for you.
On this page: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] you can find plans for a "gaita sanabresa", a bagpipe of relatively simple construction which shows all the characteristics of a bagpipe of the "atlantic" (or "celtic") type: conical bored chanter with double reed, bass drone with single reed, and probably quite loud.
If you join this group here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] you will get access to these files: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which have plans for a gaita asturiana as well as for Scottish highland bagpipes (without the chanter, but somewhere in the forum Seth has kindly given the dimensions he uses, you'll have to use the search function, type in "GHB chanter").
Of all these bagpipes, uilleann pipes are the most complicated, and I would strongly advice you to gather experience with other projects before you attempt to make these, otherwise you will almost certainly be making expensive firewood. Also, you should be able to play them well enough to judge if the instrument is capable of doing what it's supposed to do, and you have to be an accomplished reed maker.


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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:44 pm

hi everybody

I have been working on the small pipes and all you said seth were rigth. Actually, I simply can´t make one reed that fixes to mi creation!!! I just cant make the drones sound I´m gettin´ a little bit crazy!!! but I´ll stand on my ground (as the big johnny cash said) and I´ll keep on trying.

Something that is causin´problems is the bag. I dont really know how to make it so... please can someone help me whit this stuff? please I need to know what kind of leather is needed or how to make it "sealed" (sorry if this is not the word than means what i want to say, what I mean is to close the bag so the air can not scape from it)

michael, what you said is completly rigth. I didn´t say what kind of music I wanted to play and it´s right that the uilleann is a sick one to begin whit Smile thank you very much. The music I want to play is similar to this one please see this video is just amazing [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] so if you have the plans for making the bagpipe that Carlos (the semibald men) plays in this video, please send them to me my email again is [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I actually do not know what kind of bagpipe is it but it´s sound is so beautifull I just can imagine a group of people dancing arround a fire drinkin´beer and having a good time (what a way to live I just wonder when I´ll be living like that)

the last thing I´ll ask you for is to please say where I can learn how to make reeds (I´d prefer plastic ones but even wood or cane ones are all right)

I´ll stay in touch everybody see you soon


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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  MichaelLoos on Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:33 am

Hi Rodrigo,
so you're basically starting from zero, which makes things a bit more complicated.
You don't really need plans, you need advice and someone who shows you how to, which, unfortunately we can't provide over the internet.
One of the biggest problems is: you are new to pipemaking, plus, you are new to reedmaking. So, you make a pipe and a reed for it, and the whole thing doesn't work. You will never know, is the pipe faulty, or is it the reed, or both. In the beginnig,it is very unlikely you can produce a working reed - you will have to make 20 or 30 of them before you get the first good one. A good way to start with would be, make the smallpipe chanter from Seth's plans, or better, make two or three of them, and get a few of the Gibson reeds he recommends, just to have reeds which are known to function. Then, take one of these chanters and adjust the tone holes until the scale is nicely in tune. The next step would be, try to make a reed which plays nicely in this same chanter. You can make these reeds from plastic, 1/2 litre yoghurt or buttermilk containers are good.They should have "PS"printed on the bottom, the ones made from "PP" are no good.
The bag is not your main problem, and it won't be until you get the rest of the instrument working. Ordinary upholstery leather of 1.2 - 1.4 mm thickness is good. The flesh side of the leather will be the outside of the bag. A good bag sealing (or "seasoning", as it is called) can be made from 20 % hide glue (soaked in water for a couple of hours) and 80 % glycerine, heat in a water bath and mix well, add a bit of benzoic acid to prevent mold. Don't overheat - the temperature should not exceed 65 °C. Pour some of the mixture into the bag and thoroughly rub into the leather and the seam. You don't need very much, 100 ml will suffice for a bag. Hang the bag up allowing any excess seasoning to drip out.
I can't access the video but your description is very clear - this must be Carlos Nunez. He is from Galicia and consequently plays a gaita gallega which is slightly different from the gaita asturiana mostly concerning the fingering. While the asturian gaita employs a half-closed fingering system, the galician gaita is being played open-fingered.A good place to start collecting information about gaitas would be here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Again it is very difficult starting from scratch. The chanter (called "punteiro") has a conical bore for which you will need a special tool which you can't really buy anywhere but you'll probably have to make it yourself. A much more practical way would be to buy a gaita chanter (which you can get from ~ 100 - 120 Euros) and first learn making reeds for it. The reeds are different from the ones for the smallpipe chanter, they are smaller and harder and produce a much louder tone. While they can be made from plastic, cane produces a significantly better tone. The best idea, however, would be to get in touch with a gaita maker and ask if he would give you a little insight to his workshop. On youtube you can find a few videos about gaita making.
The next, very big problem is, you are also new to playing, so even if you succeed in making a chanter and a reed that work, you will not be able to judge how well they work... basically, first of all, you'll have to learn to play the instrument - for which, of course, you need a good instrument to start with - again, you need personal contact to gaita players.
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  MichaelLoos on Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:40 am

Here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
are two different ways of sewing a pipe bag.
I know there are some more explanations on the net, google "bagpipe bag making".
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  Yuri on Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:10 pm

Seth has worked out a way of making completely airtight bags without sewing at all. You should contact him via PM, I'm sure he'll be happy to describe it. I know it is described somewhere on a forum, but I just don't remmber which one. (We all lurk around on quite a number of them.)
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:23 pm

hi michael:

I´ve got a pracrtice chanter of the scottish bapgpipes and I want to ask you if I can practice my reed canes making whit this practice chanter it´s a dunbar one

thank you for all the help man. what yuri said is very important to me because all I´ve got is 3 methers of leather, but it is so thin so the air (not easy I must say) can pass trought it so I want to ask you if there´s a way to "close" the microholes of this kind of leather like the wine bags we use here in spain called "botas de vino" that keep the wine whitout any fugue. I´m thinking to put my leather on water whit salt just to see what happen. do you now what to do to "close" profesionaly the leather?

thank you to everyone

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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  MichaelLoos on Sat Apr 02, 2011 12:36 am

Of course you can practice your reed making skills making reeds for your practice chanter, and these reeds will probably also work with the smallpipes from Seth's plans. But different pipes need different reeds, and being able to make one type of reed does not mean you can make any type of reed - but once you know the basics it is much easier to figure out.
From your description I would guess the leather you have is probably not suitable for making a bag. A pipe bag must 1. be airtight and 2. allow moisture to evaporate. This means, although you can make almost any leather perfectly airtight by blocking the surface (with silicone or the like) this will invariably create problems with microbes and mold inside the bag which will ruin your instrument and endanger your health. The hide glue mixture does close the pores of the leather, yet it also collects moisture and allows it to get out of the bag, through the very same pores. So, totally filling the pores is not a good idea (although it can work for bellows-blown pipes like the uilleann pipes). If, however, the leather stretches very easily, it is just unsuitable, because every time it is under pressure it will let the air out - it probably has too many and/or too big pores, or is just too weak in structure.
The "bota" you mention is a goat- or sheep skin, taken from the animal in one piece, therefore no need for a seam. It is what is widely used for bagpipe bags, mostly in Italy and in Eastern Europe, but I also have seen them used on Spanish gaitas. Again, you will have to ask a gaita maker how these skins are prepared. In Bulgaria, they are treated only with salt which results in a white skin. In Italy some copper compounds are used which colours the skin green. Spanish goatskin bags are brown so they have a different treatment for them.
Skin (which is raw) and leather (which is tanned) are two very different things, and treating the tanned leather you have with salt will not give you any desirable results.
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Re: Looking for some plans of scottish, asturian or uilleann bagpipe

Post  cerecerorodrigo on Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:01 pm

I´ve found the solution! I founded a page that shows how to make reeds (drone and chanter ones) (sorry to all it´s in spanish) if someone is interested please go to [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] for the chanter ones (this is just a guide and is for asturian ones but is usefull to every single reed)

what i´ll do is this (this video is just for the bellows, but even when I´ll put a bellow to my bagpipe for no to make wet my bag, my point is to show you how to seal a little bit more easy the skin) [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and this will be aplied to all the skin parts.

I´ve just make the chanter sound!! I´m finishing it soon and I´ll look for a camera to show you my finished work whit all your help.

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